DEBATING ABOUT ISLAM – PART 1
Once you know something about Islam and try to talk to others, you may find yourself in a debate. Here are some of the “standardsâ€.
CAN YOU READ ARABIC?Â
Everyone from Muslims to atheists uses this. The implication is that Arabic is a unique language that can’t be translated and therefore, how could you know what you are talking about? First, the Koran claims to be a universal message for all humanity for all times. If the message is universal, then it must be able to be understood by all. If the message cannot be understood by everybody, then by definition it is not universal. So, which is it?
Another thing to consider is that over half of the Koran is about kafirs and politics. Do you really think that a political message about a kafir cannot be understood by the kafir? If so, what is that message that cannot be understood?
It must be made clear which Arabic is being spoken about. The Arabic of the Koran is classical Arabic which is about as similar to modern Arabic as the English of Chaucer and Beowulf is similar to modern English. Said in another way, not even a modern Arab can read classical Arabic. It is estimated that fewer than a thousand scholars who read classical Arabic can compose a paragraph on a random topic.
And what about the nearly billion Muslims who don’t even understand modern Arabic? If it is necessary to understand classical Arabic to understand what the Koran is about, then how can those billion non-Arabic-speaking Muslims understand the Koran? And if they cannot understand the Koran how can they be Muslims?
Ask the person who presents the argument if they have any opinions about the doctrine of Christianity. Then ask them if they read Hebrew, Aramaic or Biblical Greek? If they do not read those languages how can they form an opinion about something they have to read in translation? Of course they can read it and form an opinion, the same way we can read and understand the Koran.
A secondary question is why would anyone want to believe that the Koran couldn’t be understood? What is the purpose of believing that out of all the books in the world, why would there be one that cannot be translated?
The Koran is only 18% of the total doctrine. Would the questioner believe that the other 82% of the doctrine not be understood as well?
WELL, THE CHRISTIANS DID…Â
This response usually comes after some grim facts are given about Islam. This is probably the most common response from non-Christians. The best response is to ask if they have a reason that they don’t want to talk about Islam, since they want to change the subject. The average person knows next to nothing about Islam and sometimes this gambit is merely a way to steer the conversation into a familiar ground.
They are just trying to prove that Islam is not any worse than Christianity. At this point, welcome the chance to compare the two. Choose the ground of comparison. The best place to start is the founders. Compare Mohammed to Christ. The other good comparison is in ethics. Compare Islam’s dualistic ethics to unitary Golden Rule ethics.
Another version of this is that the person will compare some failed Christian to a “good†Muslim they know at work. It is fairly useless to do personal comparisons. How do you choose which Muslim out of 1.5 billion Muslims and which Christian do you choose out of a couple billion Christians?
A variation on the “Well, the Christians did …†is “What about the Crusades� This is the time to say you welcome a comparison of the Crusades to jihad. Start with the question of why the Crusades were needed. Islamic jihad caused the invasion of the Middle East. The Crusades were a response to a cry for help by the tortured and oppressed Christians in their native land. Did the Christians do some very wrong things? Yes, but notice that the Crusades have been over nearly a thousand years. Jihad is active today. And while we are at it, why do academic libraries have many books on the Crusades, which lasted only 200 years, and so few on jihad, which has lasted 1400 years? The West has analyzed the Crusades forever and has never analyzed jihad.
I KNOW THIS MUSLIM AND HE SAYS…
Why is the Muslim your friend knows the only Muslim out of 1.5 billion that makes him the expert on Islam? Remember, the average Muslim knows very little about the doctrine of Islam. Why? Because, historically the imams have acted as the high priests of Islam and they have never made the doctrine simple to understand. That is one way they keep their prestige and power.
But once you know something about the doctrine, you can say that you know also know a Muslim, and his name is Mohammed, and what you say comes from the Sunna. In short, your Muslim, Mohammed, can beat your friend’s Muslim on any issue of doctrine. If the Muslim your friend knows says something about Islam that agrees with Mohammed, then it is right. If what he says contradicts Mohammed, then he is wrong. So this Muslim your friend knows is either wrong or redundant, but never more right than Mohammed.
I KNOW THIS MUSLIM AND HE IS A NICE MAN
Probably so. What does that prove about Islam? He may follow the Golden Rule and not Islam. That is, he may be a poor Muslim and a good person.
Now is the time to explain about the Islam of Mecca and the Islam of Medina and which one is the more powerful. It is also time to explain about dualism and how Islam always has two faces.
Stay with doctrine and history of Islam, never get personal and talk about an individual Muslim. Actually, there is one way to talk about any Muslim, show how what they do and say follows the doctrine.
Besides, you know this Muslim and his name is Mohammed. Don’t talk about “Muslims,†talk about Mohammed.
THAT IS NOT THE REAL ISLAM
If you are quoting the Koran or the Sunna, then it is the real Islam, by definition. The Koran and the Sunna are Islam, the real Islam. All other Islam, such as is found in the media, is the false Islam. There is only one real Islam, the doctrine of Islam.
THEY DON’T REALLY BELIEVE THAT.Â
This comes after you have revealed some horrific part of the doctrine. What do Muslims call themselves? The believers. What do they believe? The Koran and the Sunna. They say that is what they believe. Really believe.
I KNOW THIS MUSLIM AND HE IS NOT VIOLENT
This is a restating of, “I know this Muslim and he is good man.†He may be a poor Muslim and a good man who follows the Golden Rule.
But, the statement shows that there is no understanding of the duality of Islam. The Koran has both violence and tolerance against the kafirs. Today in America the power of Islam is just getting started, so Islam is still weak. When Mohammed was weak in Mecca, he did not kill anybody. Islam is still in the first phase of jihad here.
But the Koran says that one Muslim can beat two kafirs. It also says that Islam must be the dominant political system. So when Muslims reach a third of the population (that makes it 2 to 1), they will be in the full stage of Medina and violence becomes a standard operation. But even then, we know from the Sira, that many Muslims just don’t have the stomach for the violence. The Sira shows that Muslims can support jihad many ways, besides personal violence. The “peaceful†Muslim you know is commanded to give money to Islamic charities and the charities give the money to the actual fighters.
WHAT ABOUT THE VIOLENCE IN THE OLD TESTAMENT?
Look at the violence in the Old Testament. It has two qualities—local and temporary. None of the violence is commanded to be global and eternal. In each case the violence is directed in a political struggle and when it was over it was over.
The violence in the Trilogy is for all Muslims, in all places and for all time. Jihad is to stop only when every kafir submits. Look at Mohammed, the perfect example. He was involved with violence until the day he died. And on his deathbed he directed eternal violence against the kafirs when he said in his last breath: “Let there be neither Christian or Jew left in Arabia.â€
IF ISLAM IS SO VIOLENT, HOW CAN IT BE SO SUCCESSFUL?
The Sira records that when Islam committed violence, it attracted new followers. As Osama bin Laden says: “People like a winning horse.†After 9/11 in the US, new followers joined Islam. Communism was a political system that preached, promised and delivered violence and it attracted many people. Many people love violence. Have you never paid any attention to Hollywood? Violence is piled upon violence and people line up to see it.
Islam is growing rapidly. but most of the growth can be attributed to high birth rates, not conversion. Islam’s growth in kafir countries is due to immigration, not conversion.
DEBATING ABOUT ISLAM – PART – 2
1. A Federal prosecutor may be in trouble because he’s a smart, successful kafir.
2. Jihad against the Christians at the highest level!  A Common Word is supreme jihad by Islamic scholars and the Muslim Brotherhood, championed by the usual dhimmi suspects at Yale, Harvard and Princeton Divinity Schools. Here’s the brilliant rebuttal by knowledgeable kafirs to this taqiyya-fest titled, “Truth About A Common Word.â€
3. The Muslim Brotherhood supreme guide in Egypt on Bin Laden the jihad fighter, Sharia law and various other hot Islamic political topics. From Memri.org.
THERE ARE DIFFERENT KINDS OF ISLAMÂ
The differences in the different kinds of Islam are due to religion, not politics. Take the Sunni/Shia split, the largest division in Islam. Both Sunnis and Shias completely agree on how to treat kafirs and jihad. All Muslim subscribe to one of five schools of the Sharia and the Sharia’s position regarding kafirs and jihad is the nearly the same for all the schools.
The only big difference is whether to use violent jihad or peaceful jihad against the kafirs.
HADITH—SOME OF THOSE AREN’T REAL
If you quote a hadith to a Muslim and they don’t like it, they will say, “Well, some of those hadiths are not acceptable (or true or some other disclaimer).†And that is true. Actually, when a Muslim says that, they are practicing taqiyya, sacred deception and duality. If it is a hadith, then a Muslim cannot be denied the right to follow it. It is Sunna.
The hadiths from Bukhari and Muslim are the creme de la creme of hadiths. When Bukhari made his collection, he threw out 99% of those he found. Those 99% are the unsure ones, the other 1% which are used here are authoritative.
THE MYTH OF THE ARABS, ABRAHAM AND ISHMAEL
The core of the myth is told in the Koran about how Adam built the Kabah at Mecca. It was the first house of worship. Then Abraham brought Ishmael to Mecca, prepared to perform the sacrifice demanded by God. Ishmael was left in Mecca with his mother, Hagar.
We have a very detailed report of Mecca at the time of Mohammed right down to the names of individuals, their children and wives. Arabs were very keen on family relationships. A person’s very name gave you his father’s or son’s name and a chain of relationships. One of the things that infuriated the Meccans about Mohammed was that he said their ancestors were in Hell since they were not Muslims.
Not a single person in Mohammed’s Mecca is named Abraham, Ishmael, or Hagar. Not one. Why? They had no knowledge about any relationship between the Arabs and Abraham. They knew of the Jews and Abraham, but they made no claim of kinship with their names. After Mohammed, these names became common amongst Muslims.
This has another large implication. Islam claims that Muslims, Christians and Jews are members of the Abrahamic faith. Not so. There is no such thing. It was an unsubstantiated claim by Mohammed.
THE ISLAMIC GOLDEN AGE
If you spend any time talking about Islam you will hear: “What about the greatness of the Islamic Golden Age? Why, the West got all of its real learning from the Muslims. They preserved the Greek philosophers, invented algebra, chemistry, the algorithm and laid the basis of our learning.†Or: “The high point of human civilization occurred in Baghdad and Moorish Spain. It was all peace and harmony with Christians, Jews and Muslims living in multi-cultural compatibility.â€
“When Europe was mired in the Dark Ages, Islam was a shining light on the hill. “
Hmmm. Let’s go over the data. Notice that the best of Islam is compared with the worst of the West. First, there never was a “Dark Ageâ€. This prejudicial naming came from the time of the Renaissance when they looked back at the dogmatic approach to knowledge in medieval times and wanted to separate themselves from it. It is just like new rich wanting to shed their poor ancestry.
Let’s examine the Middle Ages for a moment and see how they came about. The collapse of Greek and Roman civilization came about from internal problems of too much wealth for too long. The ravages of the bubonic plague wiped out an estimated 30 to 60 percent of the European population, making it vulnerable to invasion. The annihilation of the centers of learning came from the jihad of Islam. So even if you want to use the term Dark Ages, at least recognize the influence of jihad.
And let’s look at how “un-dark†the “Dark Ages†were. Everyone agrees that the Renaissance was one of humanity’s great moments. But how did all of that greatness spring from the “Dark Ages� You don’t get a champion racehorse from a plug mare. The Middle Ages were a time when the European man was created. The collapse of Roman central government allowed a new culture to emerge that was a fusion of Roman, Greek, Celtic and Germanic culture. Part of this culture was mechanical genius.
Europe was creating a new mind, the mind that would change the world by producing practical machines such as water mills and a thousand small improvements in daily life. The cathedrals were a stunning tribute to humanity and works of great beauty.Â
Without the Middle Ages there could not have been a Europe or a Renaissance.
Now look at the Golden Age of Islam in Baghdad. Where did it come from? Not from Islam. The Koran was the first book written in Arabia. Architecture in Arabia consisted of mud huts. Mohammed’s house was made from mud bricks; a man could touch the ceiling and a curtain served as a door. Arabic culture was barely iron age with its only art being poetry.
So where did the learning come from? Islam crushed the Christian, Zoroastrian, Buddhist and Hindu cultures and brought them all together in one culture. The scholars of these cultures were brought together and created an intellectual surge called the Islamic Golden Age. It was kafirs who created this so-called Golden Age while Islam took the credit. As an example, we call our numbers Arabic numerals. But the Arabs got them from the Hindus and took credit. We should call our numbers Hindu numerals.
It was Christian dhimmis who translated all of the Greek and Roman literature for their masters. Later, when this material was translated back into Greek and Latin, the Muslims got the credit for the work. In short, Islam got its knowledge just like it got its wealth— from theft and violence.
Islam cannot sustain any intellectual effort. Their own scholars cannot do the work due to the limitations of the dogma of Islamic thought.
And what were the Muslims able to do with this knowledge? Not much. What did they do with glass? Make pretty windows for the mosque. Europeans took glass and made microscopes and telescopes as well as stained glass. What did the Muslims do with mathematics? Not much. They combined the mathematics of the Greeks and Hindus and created algebra. And what did they do with algebra? Nothing. When it came back to Europe, the Europeans created calculus and physics.
A list of the great Arabic scholars reveals that many on the list were Christians with Arabic names. And the best of the Muslim scholars turned out not to be very Muslim and their works were later demolished by Muslims who were true to the real knowledge of Islam, the Koran.
Now let’s look at the great Moorish Spain. It was supposed to be a great center of multiculturalism. Of course, there was that day in Cordoba when the Muslims killed 8,000 Jews, but ignore that. What did Islam do as soon as it came to Spain? Shipped a thousand blondes off to be slaves in North Africa. But ignore that. Then there was the day when, after a battle against the Christian knights, they beheaded all the corpses and all the prisoners to build a hill of skulls. A Muslim then mounted the hill of skulls and issued the call to prayer. But ignore that.
How can any culture that makes slaves and dhimmis of all kafirs be called great? Simple. It served the needs of the groups that pushed the idea. It was Voltaire and Jewish scholars who created the idea of the Golden Age in Moorish Spain. Why? As an intellectual counterweight to the hated Catholic church. That propaganda attack survives today. It is the intellectuals who hate Christianity today, who push the same ideas.
If Islamic learning was so great, then where are the great Muslim scholars of today? No Islamic nation has ever had a Nobel prize in science. Not one. There have been eight Muslims who shared Nobel prizes in science, but it occurred in working in kafir nations and with kafir partners.
Bill Warner
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